Miraslau Kobasa: Why they are called terrorists in Chechnya and people's volunteer corps in Ukraine?

How does Russian propaganda use double standards in broadcasting Ukrainian events? Why does it refer to Bandera and what unites “Nord-Ost” siege and “Donetsk People’s Republic”?

EuroBelarus Information Service talked about the difficult situation in Ukraine with Miraslau Kobasa, the chairman of the Enlightenment Public Association “Lew Sapieha Foundation”, which is one of the oldest non-government organizations working in the sphere of local government.

- What is your attitude towards the events unfolding in your country?

- Like most people who can analyze the situation in Ukraine themselves and not only on the basis of TV broadcasting, I see Russia’s aggression, as how else can we name the seizure of territory and annexation to Russia? As to the statement about the alleged protection of Russians in Ukraine from some nationalistic groups, this is guesswork; there are no concrete facts, especially in regard to Crimea, where everything got started.

Concerning the events in Lugansk and Donetsk regions, it is clear where the commands originate from. It is deliberate fomentation of war; moreover, the fomentation of interethnic discord has been brought to the state level.

- Does it mean that pro-Russian demonstrations in the eastern Ukraine don’t really reflect the sentiments of the Ukrainian society, but are staged by the Russian intelligent services?

- Yes, of course. There is no doubt that some people would like to see changes and federation status for their regions. But some people in Russia also would like to see, let’s say, separation of Chechnya.

By the way, the situation with Chechnya is an example of double standards. Russian army is still fighting against the civilian population in Chechnya; if we recall Chechen campaigns, at that time Russian army was shooting at everyone without discriminating between the civilian population and gunmen.

Let’s also recall Russian special operation in connection with the “Nord-Ost” siege (Moscow theater hostage crisis), when 20 or 30 terrorists seized the spectators and about 300 civilians were killed in result of the actions of the Russian authorities.

So why they are called terrorists in Chechnya and people's volunteer corps in Ukraine? It is an open demonstration of double standards. There is no phenomenon of separatism in Ukraine; it is a farfetched phenomenon that was being provoked. It is important to differentiate between separatism and the wish to have more authority voiced by the regions; these things are different.

I support the desire of the regions to have more authority, including financial decentralization. And I want to emphasize that it is the lack of real local self-government that furthered the development of the current situation in Ukraine. This factor is still affecting the Ukrainian situation.

Russia wants to have influence upon the Ukrainian regions. If Ukraine’s federalization takes place, Russia will be able to get some part of Ukraine under and make it economically and politically dependent, passing the centre.

- So is the difference between western and eastern Ukrainians that big as pictured in the Russian media?

- In depends on the prospective that we look from. Of course, Western Ukraine is Europe-oriented and has a little bit different value guidelines than that in the Eastern Ukraine. By value guidelines I mean all that caused EuroMaidan: insufferable situation with bribery in medicine, education, business; basically, the rule of lawlessness.

However, I am sure that neither those who live in Eastern Ukraine nor those living in the Western Ukraine want a war.

Secondly, the attitude towards the Ukrainian history. Why was Bandera referred to? It has been knocked in the head of people since Soviet times. As if we try to sort things out, we should rather talk about people from NKVD, who were responsible for deaths of civilian population; all the more that Russia is a successor of the Soviet Union.

And, of course, the national language. it is a matter of principle for the Western Ukraine, as even during the double-dyed times of Brezhnev rule, people understood how valuable the language is. At the same time, in the east of Ukraine traditionally those in power used to be assigned, and didn’t have good background, which still affects the life of the Eastern Ukraine.

- By the way: you was born in Ivano-Frankivsk region, so you fall under the dangerous category of “bloody Bandera followers”, don’t you?

- This category is applied to everyone who is speaking his or her mother tongue. If you start talking in your own language, if you start defending the interests of your own country, its history, it means that you are perceived as a nationalist.

From the perspective of Russia, Suvorov is a hero. But if we recall his actions in Belarus – and he killed 150 hundred people – why should he be a hero for us? The same is true for the Western Ukraine: a man who was fighting for Ukraine’s freedom and better life for people is a hero. And the fact that there were victims from both the sides happens in every war.

- Reports about the death toll in Ukraine now tend to come every day. What should the Ukrainian government and the world community undertake in order to stop the insane adventure of Putin and sabotage of GRU (Glavnoye Razvedyvatel'noye Upravleniye, Russian Main Intelligence Directorate)?

- Even if Russia would have some concrete claims to Ukraine, it should have sit down at the negotiating table to solve them. The decision can be found only during the negotiations, though not with the terrorists, of course.

Literally some days ago the dialog has started, which, I believe, is good. But still, I find Russia’s claims to see terrorists at the negotiation table inadmissible. There can be no representation of people who call themselves “people's volunteer corps”, as they represent the interests of foreign country, not that of Ukrainian citizens.

What should we do? Of course, we should have elections on May 25 and choose the president. Though, I believe that the current authority represented by Verkhovna Rada is absolutely legitimate. But in order to strengthen this legitimacy we should choose the president, change the Constitution, establish and develop local self-government, i.e. decentralize the power, and fight down corruption. People should see not only promises given by the authorities, but their actions, too.

- Whom would you like to see as the Ukrainian president?

- A person who believes that Ukraine is his motherland; a patriot who cares about his country. The most important thing is that he should be capable to peacefully settle the situation in Ukraine and improve people’s lives, and, finally, to lead his country to the common European family. I am ready to support any candidate who meets the listed criteria, and is an honest, smart and competent politician.

-  Is the Lew Sapieha Foundation which you are heading planning to take part in help operations, such as the “Marathon of solidarity” with Ukraine, or help some other way?

- As a head of the Foundation, I am ready to take part in such events. As to the organization, such decisions are made by the board of administration. But I think that my colleagues will support me.

The example of Belarus makes the mistakes which Ukraine cannot make visible. The first one is the language problem: today it is presented as a treasure, but what will people say tomorrow if Belarus is annexed? That is why Ukrainian should be given a status of a state language.

I would like to wish our civil society to reach that level of self-consciousness and development that has already been reached by Ukrainians. And I wish Ukraine to end the crisis as soon possible.